Guest article by N Venkataraman
(Mr N Venkataraman had been benefitting the SoY readers with his erudite comments for quite some time. Therefore, when Mr Ashok Vaishnav’s mega series on Multiple Version Songs came along, my thoughts went to him for doing Hindi songs and their versions in South Indian languages. I am grateful that he accepted my request. He starts with Tamil, and this too he proposes to do in three parts, which he explains in the article. With Ashokji’s three articles, and the last guest article by Mr Arunkumar Deshmukh on Hindi-Marathi, the mega series is now taking shape as we had envisaged. Please enjoy another learned article in the series, which is the first guest article by Venkataramanji. This would be hopefully followed by many more. – AK)
In the first of the series of articles on this theme, Ashok Vaishnavji had presented an overview of the various types of multiple version songs. In his overview he had elaborated the types of possible variations and some very broad categories of this theme. He had suggested separate post for each of the categories/sub-categories and further suggested a collaborative effort in compiling bank of songs and in volunteering to write guest posts on some of the categories. AKji had laid out the road map for further exploration of the subject and reiterated the views expounded by Ashok Vaishnavji on collaborative efforts on this theme. I had mentioned in my comment that this is a monumental task and the effort deserves to be organized and well documented. In the meantime, Ashok Vaishnavji has come out with the second and third part in the series, and in the last post Arunkumar Deshmukhji has given an outstanding overview of Hindi-Marathi linkage in films and songs. Inspired by these painstaking efforts, and after an encouraging communication from AKji, I decided to venture into an area, where I have not made any serious attempt earlier.
The South Indian film songs encompass the four major languages, Tamil, Telugu, Malayalam and Kannada. Ideally, each of the ‘South Indian language film songs’ should have separate article. My maiden attempt will delve into Tamil film songs only. I have further classified the subject into 3 sub-categories. ‘Inspired and adopted melodies’ in the first part, ‘Songs from dubbed versions’ in the second and ‘Songs from remakes’ in the third. In this article, I will be covering the first part, namely the ‘Inspired and adopted melodies’.
From the late 1940s Tamil film music began to be influenced by Hindi film music. In spite of their inherent limitations in understanding the lyrics, Hindi film music was enjoyed and appreciated by South Indian listeners. ‘Inspired’ by Hindi film music, popular Hindi tunes were ‘adopted’ in South Indian films and the South Indian music lovers enjoyed such ‘Inspirational adoptions’. This trend continued to a great extent till the 60s. But during this period, it is difficult to find any Tamil film melodies adopted in Hindi film music. I would be more than pleased, if our knowledgeable readers come up with examples to the contrary. The music of the South and the North, apparently similar and enjoyed and appreciated by both the listeners, had their differences. One would not find instance of any South Indian music director composing scores for Hindi films in the 50s, 60s or even in the 70s. Some of the double version or multi version films and dubbed films were the exceptions. In most of the Hindi remakes of the Tamil film, the Tamil music directors were replaced by North Indian music composers. The composers of the remakes preferred to score fresh tunes rather than retaining the original Tamil tunes. There were rare instances where they had retained the original tunes.
Let me begin with a selection of ‘Inspired and adopted melodies’ for the delectation of the listeners/readers.
Here are three songs from the film Vazhkai (The life) (1949). The film Vazhkai was produced and directed by A V Mieyappa Chettiar (AVM Productions). AVM simultaneously produced the film in Telugu as Jeevitham and remade it in Hindi as Bahar in 1951. Vyjayanthimala, the budding teenage Bharatanatyam dancer made her debut in this movie and in due course emerged as a major star of Indian Cinema. AVM Chettiar had the screenplay suitably amended to include dance sequences. The original songs were from three different, but earlier Hindi films.
1T. Enni enni paarka manam by MR Rajeshwari from Vazhkai (The Life) (1949), lyrics Kamakshi Sundaram, music Sudarshanam
The Tamil version is set to a faster meter, and Vyjayanthimala, yet to shed her ‘baby fat’, with her expressive eyes and graceful dance movements, had given a scintillating performance. This is a classic example of an adopted song, and Kamakshi Sundaram had done an excellent job by providing fitting lyrics. The Tamil version was rendered equally well by M R Rajeshwari. Let us listen to the Tamil version of the song first.
1H. Chup chup khade ho by Lata Mangeshkar and Premlata from Badi Bahen (1949), lyrics Qamar Jalalabadi, music Husnlal Bhagatram
While the street singers enact this beautiful song, the leading pair, Suraiya and Rehman, exchanges silent expressions. This song bears the typical stamp of Husnlal-Bhagatram Music.
In the Tamil version of the next song, Vyjayanthimala drives an open hooded Morris Minor (?) with T R Ramachandran sitting beside her. In contrast, Dilip Kumar drives a bullock cart with Nargis beside him. The orchestration of the Tamil version is also different. The Hindi version of the song, though set to a slower tempo, sounds more vibrant than the Tamil version. Needless to say, the original score was composed by, one and the only, Naushad. Let us listen to the songs.
2T. Sen thamizhum suvaiyum polave by M R Rajeshwari and T R Ramachandran from Vazhkai (1949), lyrics Kamakshi Sundaram, music Sudarshanam
2H. Mein bhanwara tu hai phool by Shamshad Begum and Mukesh from Mela (1948), lyrics Shakeel Badayuni, music Naushad
Let me share an interesting anecdote. A V Mieyappa Chettiar and his team were coming out of a cinema hall after watching a Hindi movie, Khidki (1948), when he heard M. R. Rajeswari humming a tune from the film. The music director of the film was C Ramchandra and the song (male chorus & female chorus versions) was Kismat hamare saath hai in which there was a catchy refrain — Dadada dadada dadadada. AVM Chettiar decided to have a similarly tuned song in Vazhkai. Kamakshi Sundram wrote the song and the in-house music director, Sudarsanam, tuned it. Two versions of the song (female and male) were recorded for the film Vazhkai and both the versions became very popular. Let us listen to the male version of the Tamil song first.
3T. Un kann unnai ematrinal by T R Ramachandran from film Vazhkai (1949), lyrics Kamakshi Sundaram, music Sudarshanam
The leading lady teasing the ‘hero’, that too in a male-attire must have been a bold depiction in those days. In the earlier song we saw her driving a car. Here is the female version sung by M R Rajeshwari.
The male version of the Hindi original
3H. Kismat hamare saath by Md Rafi, Chitalkar & chorus from Khidki (1948), lyrics P L Santoshi, music C Ramachandra
Here is the female version of the Hindi original sung by Shamsad Begum, Lata Mangeshkar & Mohantara Talpade. This song is special for several reasons. This is one of the early songs sung by Lata Mangeshkar. Through this song I have found Mohantara Talpade. Finally this multi version song brings to light another category viz. male chorus and female chorus with more than one (main) singer. Although the Tamil version was rendered well, comparatively the Hindi versions sound much better. I am afraid that I have started ruffling a few feathers!
Let us on move on to the 50s. The film Thai Ullam (Mother’s Mind) (1952) was based on the novel ‘East Lynne’ by Henry Wood. This film was a major breakthrough for the then struggling actor named R. Ganesh, who later came to be known as Gemini Ganeshan.
4T. Konjum purave by M L Vasanthakumari from film Thai Ullam (1952), lyrics Udumalai Narayana Kavi / Surabhi (?), music V Nagaiah and Adheppali Rama Rao
This song was adopted/adapted from the Hindi song Thandi hawaein. M L Vasanthakumari, a classical singer, had beautifully rendered this song in Carnatic style, with subtle Kampithams /Gamakams to suit the taste of the South Indian listeners. This song was very popular. It is not clear whether the lyrics were written by Surabhi or Narayana Kavi. The lilting music of S D Burman has to give way to the use of Violin in the prelude and interlude.
4H. Thandi hawaein by Lata Mangeshkar from Naujawan (1951), lyrics Sahir Ludhianvi, Music S D Burman
This is a beautiful composition with equally beautiful lyrics. This immortal song of Lata Mangeshkar will be a strong contender for the best female song of 1951.
5T. Aasai pongum azhagu roopam by Krishnaveni (Jikki) and A M Rajah from Aasai (Desire) (1956), lyric Marutha Kasi, music T R Pappa
Aasai is the Tamil remake of the Hindi film Dulari (1949). Naushad was the Music Director for Dulari. But, this song Aasai pongum azhagu roopam, was adopted from the 1955 Hindi movie Jhanak Jhanak Payal Baje and was again set to a faster tempo.
Nain so nain nahi milao was a big musical hit and was extensively discussed in the post ‘Best Songs of 1955’ and was declared the second best duet for 1955 in ‘Wrap up 3’.
5H. Nain so nain nahi milao by Lata Mangeshkar and Hemant Kumar from Jhanak Jhanak Payal Baje, lyrics Hasrat Jaipuri, music Vasant Desai
6T. Senthamizh then mozhiyal by T R Mahalingam from Maalayitta Mangai (The Garlanded Maiden) (1958), lyrics Kannadasan, music M.S. Viswanathan—Ramamoorthy
Set to Raag Kapi (Carnatic) Sentamizh Thenmozhiyal is rendered beautifully by T.R. Mahalingam. First let us listen to the song.
MS Vishwanathan was a great admirer of Naushad. There is an interesting story related to this song. Here is a quote from an interview of MS Vishwanathan by Sriram Lakshman, in the year 2005.
“‘Naushad enakku deivam mathiri’ (Naushad is like God to me) is an admiration-laden starting point. Naushad’s music in Anmol Ghadi, Rattan, Udan Khatola, Baiju Bawra, Aan, he says, elevated him to ecstatic states. He fondly recollects the days of waiting on tenterhooks for the release of a Naushad’s Album. Interesting to note that he included Aan which had Muhabbat choome jinke haath, rendered by Rafi, the pallavi of which, though set to a slightly different meter, was applied to kick-start the hugely famous Senthamizh then mozhiyal in Malayitta Mangai (1957). The fact that Naushad used the same meter for his Hue hum jinke liye barbaad sung by Rafi in Deedar (1951) is a different matter altogether”. In AKji’s parlance- ‘Auto-plagiarism’.
(Note: The thumbnail of this article is a photograph of Naushad with MS Vishwanathan).
I think Deedar was produced before Aan and the Tamil version’s start is more akin to the Deedar song rather than that of Aan. Here are those two inspirational songs; first one from Aan and the second one from Deedar. Naushad-Shakeel-Rafi combination is mesmerising.
6H. Mohabbat choome jinke haath by Md Rafi from Aan (1952), lyrics Shakeel Badayuni, music Naushad
Hue hum jinke liye barbaad by Md Rafi from Deedar (1951), lyrics Shakeel Badayuni, music Naushad
Let us move over to the 60s.
Adutha Veettu Penn (1960) is a Tamil remake of the Bengali movie Paser Bari (1952), which was again remade in Hindi as Padosan (1968). Pakkinti Ammayi, the Telugu version of this film was made twice, once in 1953 and again in 1980.
The Tamil song from this film, which I am presenting next, was adopted from another Hindi film Ghar Sansar (1958). The Tamil version is set to a slower tempo. Another interesting observation is that the tune of a duet, where the female voice is predominant, was used for a male solo in the Tamil version. Adi Narayana Rao had changed the prelude and interlude music effectively. Let us listen to the Tamil song first and then the Hindi version from the film Ghar Sansar.
7T. Kannale Pesi Pesi Kollathe by PB Srinivas from Adutha Veettu Penn (The Girl Next door) (1960), lyrics T N. Ramiah Dass , music Adi Narayana Rao
Here is the romantic Hindi song sequence set on a breezy Poonam Ki Raat on a river bank. The music of Ravi stands out in this composition. Was Kumkum driving a Chevrolet Impala? It will be interesting to have a post on cars of different makes and models used in Hindi film song-sequences!
7H. Yeh hawa yeh nadi ka kinara by Manna Dey and Asha Bhosle from Ghar Sansar (1958), lyrics Majrooh Sultanpuri, music Ravi
There was one music director, who drew immense inspiration from the popular numbers of the Hindi films. He liberally ‘adopted’ many of those songs in his Tamil films. To be fair to him, it should be mentioned that he also gave many memorable original tunes. He did a ‘yeoman service’ to the music lovers of the South in general and to his fans in particular by adopting many songs – lock, stock and barrel! The list is a long one. I am presenting three such songs of music director Veda. Here are the Tamil version songs followed by the Hindi original.
8T. Manaennum medai mele by P Susheela and T M Sounderarajan from Vallavanukku Vallavan (Master of Masters) (1965), lyrics Kavignar Kannadasan, music Veda
8H. Sau saal pehle mujhe tumse by Md.Rafi and Lata Mangeshkar from Jab Pyar Kisi Se Hota Hai (1961), lyrics Hasrat Jaipuri, music Shanker Jaikishen
9T. Nerukku Ner by P Susheela and T M Sounderarajan from Ethirigal Jakkirathai (Enemies Beware) (1967), lyrics Kavignar Kannadasan, music Veda
9H. O mere sona re sona re sona re by Md Rafi and Asha Bhosle from Teesri Manzil (1966), Lyrics Majrooh Sultanpuri, Music R D Burman, Singers
10T. Nanathale kangal minna minna by T M Sounderarajan and P Susheela from CID Shankar (1970), lyrics Kavignar Kannadasan, music Veda
10H. Dil pukare aa re aa re aa re by Md Rafi and Lata Mangehskar from Jewel Thief (1967), lyrics Majrooh Sultanpuri, music S D Burman
I started Life (Vazhkai) watching young budding actress Vyjayanthimala and ended up with Jewel Thief; Devanand sensuously holding the hands of a matured Vyjayanthimala, after almost two decades. Ah. That is all in a nutshell.
The later period heralded the advent of Music Directors of a different genre in Tamil films. Ilayaraja, Shankar-Ganesh, A R Rehman and many other composers emerged on the scene. Somewhere around the 90s the reverse trend started. In my humble opinion, the songs of this period are beyond the ambit of this post and I am also not very familiar with melodies of this period.
{ 160 comments… read them below or add one }
It is but natural that with such ace ‘players’ ( Arunkumar Deshmukh, N Venkatraman) entering the relay of multiple versions, and AKiji continuing to play the role of a competent enabling ‘coach’, the game is bound be intersting and absorbing.
I have to admit to having zero knowledge of Tamil cinema, and am only midway through listening to the Tamil versions of the songs – but I did want to say a big thank you to Mr N Venkataraman: this is a great post. And the songs are lovely – it’s interesting to see the similarities and the differences between the Tamil and Hindi versions.
I stopped worrying about where the inspiration came from, and thoroughly enjoyed listening to the Tamil songs that I’d grown up with 🙂 Thank you, Mr Venkataraman. 🙂
What you say about the cross-pollination of songs into South Indian languages is very true. This is the case with my native Malayalam as well.
Thank you Mr Venkataraman for this very interesting post. I eagerly look forward to the remaining two articles in the series on the same theme. Listening to the same tune, with or without variation, in another language – particularly one that I don’t understand at all – is a strangely exhilarating experience and makes the original song sound sweeter.
You have rightly left out the recent songs by Ilyaraja, A R Rahman etc. The new trend is to make the same movie simultaneously in multiple languages with the same music director composing for all versions. Rahman is rightly famous for songs of Roja and Bombay. I have a special fondness for his songs from Viswavidhata which somehow did not do very well.
Came across this on another website:
For the film “Pooja Ke Phool” a song was recorded by Lataji for Nimmi who played a blind girl. The song was ‘Mujhe apni ankhiyaan dede o pyare panchi’. However on the directors insistence , Madanji rerecoreded the song basing it on the original tune of the same situation as in the Tamil version of the film, of which Pooja ke Phool was a remake. This original tune was not Madanjis and the song is ‘Miaoon miaoon meri sakhi’. Of course he imparted his own style to the antras and the music.
Would you be able to link the Tamil original? The Hindi version is special for another reason – it is a rare happy song featuring Nimmi. I remember a discussion that making a list of ten such songs would be impossible!
Venkataraman ji,
Superb ! Enjoyed very much.
I have seen and enjoyed some of the Tamil and Telugu old films of Yore and hence was able to enjoy with nostalgia. Thanks again.
Here is a ref from The Hindu,which describes the making of VAZHKAI and how and why the Hindi tunes were adopted in the film.
http://www.thehindu.com/todays-paper/tp-features/tp-cinemaplus/vazhkai-1949/article3510155.ece?textsize=small&test=2
-AD
Subodh ji,
The song which you have mentioned is one of my favourites from Telugu film MANCHI MANUSULU,sung by my pet singer Janaki. I do not recollect the Tamil version’s name at the moment,but here is the Telugu Version of Hindi song-
-AD
C Ramachandra’s iconic peppy dance tune from Asha, Ina Min Dika, itself fimled on Kishorekumar and Asha Bhosale songs –
http://youtu.be/AP5swksN1WY-
has a tamil version –
http://youtu.be/IFk6I015nq8
Ashok Vaishnavji,
Thank you for your prompt comments. It is always good to find encouraging words from the captain of the team. You have aptly commented on the role of AKji. With Akji continuing to play the role of an enabling coach, a la Jose Mourinho and you playing the role of Cristiano Ronaldo, the series is bound to be (as you have rightly said) interesting. I, as a new comer, at the most can play the role of Antonio Adan.
Madhuji (Dustedoff),
Thanks.Expecting further comments/ suggestions after you complete listening to all the songs.
Anuji,
Sugam Thanne.
Thank you for listening to the songs and reading my post. Since you are Madras-ite by upbringing, you must have understood and enjoyed the songs.By being Keralite by birth and also a Bangalorean by upbringing, I presume, you will be able to contribute immensely towards other South Indian version Songs- Hindi Songs.
Subodhji,
Thank you very much. Music has its own universal language and lack of understanding of a particular language(s) does not deter us from listening to and enjoying good music. It is true that the original tune is always sweeter barring a few exceptions.
About the song from Pooja ki Phool (1964), I am aware of this song and the original version. This is one of the two rare occasion (that I am aware of), where the Hindi Music Directors had to retain the original Tamil tune. I have planned to present them in my 3rd part on ‘Songs from Remakes’.
Arunji,
Namaskar. Thank you for your nice comments. Your reference from ‘The Hindu’ on Vazhkai, reiterates your immense knowledge not only on Hindi films, but Tamil and Telugu Films.While going through your write-up on ‘Marathi version- Hindi version songs’, I have learnt a thing or two from you. I should acknowledge my source of information, which I have obtained from net, books, newspapers and magazines that I have read, discussions etc. They could not have cropped up from my fertile imagination. Unfortunately, I did not note down the sources of my information. I would like to express my gratitude to all the sources without which it would not have been possible to put up this write-up.
The clipping from the film Manchi Manasulu was good. I have planned to present the Hindi and Tamil Versions in my 3rd part on ‘Songs from Remakes’. I am not sure which one was made earlier, the Tamil or the Telugu version, but both were produced in 1961.
Thank once again.
Ashok Vaishnavji,
Youe are right. This also from a remake. I have planned to use it in my 3 part.
Song 7T pictuarization seems to have “adopted” in Mere Samanewali Khidaki (Padosan).
“Dil Pukare Aa Re Aa Re” itself seems to be based on a Assamese or Uttaranchal (pahadi) folk tune.
this is a link to a tamizh song from ‘avan amaran’.the song begins with a tune similar to taxi driver’s ….jayen to jayen kahan…midway(@1:37) when vaanmathi joins the tune is that of …yeh raat yeh chaandani phir kahan…(a song from’ jaal’ ,a devanand geetabali starrer )
2.this one by jikki is also from ‘ avan amaran’.the song begins @ 2: 10.the tune is similar to that of ….’chalo chale maan’ a hemanta kumar composition sung by aasha bhosle for the movie’ jagriti’.
Arvind, this is beautiful. I must say Tamil composers had great taste in music! And they were also very eclectic, taking from wherever that took their fancy!
(But you have to satisfy my curiosiy. How is it that not knowing a word of Tamil, you are able to come up with such gems?)
@N. Venkataramanji….i can see only 1 yt link in my mobile screen amongst ur all pairs :(. That’s 3T. The lady wearing an elephant pant is looking terrific. But she is so beautiful looking vaijayantimala. The song she is singing is really so superb and melodious. It might be a highly popular at then time. ‘da da daan da da daan da daan da daan’:) Great work Venkatji.
i read in venkatji’s initial detail that she is really vaijayantimala !!! Wonderful discovery for non-south indians Venkatramanji. Thanx
@ Anu warrierji
If u r a keralian than i have to chat with u. First, ‘malayalam’ language is so attractive with their fantastic letters. It is too easy to write like my mother tongue, gujarati. The difficult one is kannada(in writing) amongst 4 S.indian langgs.
Second, before a decade i had borrowed a malayalam mp3 cd from a nearby keralian cycle repairer. There were songs of the films of around 2003-4 in it. I listened it repeatedly and got some lovely gems, some r still my favorites. I gave back the cd to its owner after some days. But thenafter i cudnt found those songs(except one song ”karuppinajaku veduppinajaku”) at yt after many searches, perhaps i hv only the songs lines that might not be spelled properly in english and also lost the films names. So, i request u if u already know or can find these songs than plz link it for me.
1. Poothumbi paadumo, poopadam puyiyumo
Neelvanile thingad kunyupoovinai paadum…
(most favorite 1)
2. Poomagalle poothiralle pooththudanyakinave, poornatunyakinave
3. Manninum pinninum manswarupole
Kanninum kaadinum kudirorupole
And this magnificent peppy 1 i found on YT.
4. Karuppinajaku oooo…
Veduppinajaku
well, the song is far outside of SoY’s boundary but it’s refreshing.
‘karuppinayaku’ from the film ‘swapnakoodu’ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAK3l-Cx5hw
‘Vazhkai’
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4d/Vazhkai_1949.jpg
One more Vazhkai song is discussed in the comments section of a post by Shri Arun Kumar Deshmukh
http://atulsongaday.me/2013/02/11/pyaar-ke-jahaan-ki-niraali-sarkaar-hai/
@
Venkatraman,
Very good writeup, I cannot comment on the videos because did not have enough time to go through all.
With all of you collaborating “hum logon ki chandi ho jayengi.”
Akji,
Thank you very much for providing me the space and opportunity and for making necessary corrections, additions and touch ups.
More than that I should be grateful to you for two more reasons. This gave me the opportunity to reconnect with Tamil Language, Tamil films and Tamil melodies. Although Tamil was my first language throughout my academic career, I had lost touch with Tamil for quite some time. I am glad that I accepted your proposal.
In my attempt to write this article, I found that my expression , flair and fluency is inadequate. I know I am not writing a literary piece, but as I have said earlier writing comments and adding clips is one thing and writing an article on a subject is a different cup of tea. But this assignment and future attempts will help to hone my writing skills to an extent. Better late than never.
All said and done I enjoyed the exercise. Thank you very much once again.
Gaddeswarup,
Went over the link you have given. You must have noticed, in the beginning it plays a tune of O dilwalo dil ka lagana achchh hai par kabhi kabhi in the background. Then you have rightly mentioned it has a song based on the tune of Pyar ke jahan ki nirali sarkaar hai. Patanga must have been a big hit by then (as Arunji has mentioned, it came before Vazhkai). Sundarshanam proves my point that Tamil composers had very eclectic taste; they were also very fair-minded and impartial. He takes inspiration from Naushad, C Ramchandra and Husnlal Bhagatram – each very different from the other, but being the tops at the time. Had I known about it, I would have requested Venkataramanji to do an exclusive post on Vazhkai, its music and its inspiration. I guess if we make a careful note of its background score and all the songs, its sources would be more widespread. I doubt if he would not have paid similar respect to Shyam Sundar, Khemchand Prakash and Ghulam Haider. 🙂
Venkataramanji,
I was silently chuckling to myself with delight when I saw you and Ashokji referring to my ‘role’. Here I was, a self-proclaimed novice, conducting an orchestra of renowned musicians. On a serious note, you must have seen the kind of response your article has generated. It has been a huge educative experience for me and others. I was only aware of AR Rahman’s and some other recent bilingual music. Otherwise, film songs in Tamil and other South Indian languages were just an amusing curiosity while channel surfing. They did seem similar to Bollywood style. But your article has opened a new window of appreciation. Earlier, you had given me immense pleasure with the Tamil version of Vrindavan ka Krishna Kanhaiya. My friend Arvind also has also been adding some Hindi-Tamil gems off and on – he has not answered how he does it, because I know he is as stranger to Tamil as I am.
We would be waiting for your remaining pieces in the series with a great deal of interest. I am also sure that you have much more to contribute to SoY, not only in comments but as guest writer.
@
Venkataramanji,
You have rightly described how difficult it is to write an article.
For me even writing comment is a big deal.
All I can do is think think and think.
I always feel. How great it would be, if only I could give words to my thoughts.
Ahhhh if wishes were horses beggars would ride .
There is sort of practice song in Missamma where Savitri teaches Nageswararao; it probably comes in Missiamma too. It is very close to a Shanta Apte song in Wahan. The telugu version
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96I5oavP7Vg
Arvindji
Both songs from ‘Avan Amaran’ were fantastic. Akji’s comments were appropriate.
Jignesh,
Thank you for watching the clips and reading the article.
@Mumbaikar8,
Thank you for. Hope you will find time to go through the videos very soon.
@gaddeswarup,
Thank you for the clip to one more pair of songs from ‘Vazhkai’ and “Patanga’. The last clip you have added from the Telugu Version of ‘Missyamma’ contains solfa of Raag Suddha Saveri which will be followed by the song ‘Brindavan ki Krishna Kanhaiya’ (Telegu version).
But I could not make out which song, of Shanta Apte from the film Wagan, it resembles.
Sri Venkataraman,
Shanta Apte song from Wahan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6e1FJxVd98U
The similar Missiamma practice song comes around 4:20 in this clip. Savitri’s singing is quite good and possibly we lost her singing to acting.
My impression is that copy-adopt system was fairly loose and flexible in the early days and there are stories of some MDs taking permission informally. Sometimes adopted films had different music directors but the same tunes. Quite a few adoptations seem to have come with interesting lyrics and slight changes to suit the local idioms. On the whole it seems to have been good for the public.
Sorry, link to the Missiamma clip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acMWHb8AfNQ
@gaddeswarup
Now it is clear from the clipping from the Tamil Version of ‘Missyamma’.
Shanta Apte’s number was also good.
Thanks.
I am an ardent fan of Hindi film music—-I refuse to call it Bollywood, Old film songs in particular. I grew up with Vividh Bharati and Binaca Geetmala as constant companions during my formative years . I am delighted that I bumped into this website and read the guest article . I am truly impressed withe research , commitment, and involvement of all concerned. Kudos to the entire team. I was going to mention “Meaow Meaow Poonakkkuti” from tamil movie Kumudam and “Brindavanamum NandaKumaranum yaavarukkum ” in my comments as I was reading the comments in sequence. But I found that it has already crossed the mind of the competent guest writer Mr N Venkataraman.
Congratulations !
I was also carried away by the YT links to old songs. Totally entertained. All of them were my favourites.
Way To Go Venkatraman Ji. Great Beginning.
Eagerly looking forward to the subsequent write ups
I want to add that I truly appreciate the beginning and ending with Vyjayanthimala who is the perfect icon for “South meets North”.
It just crossed my mind that ” Elanda pazham, Elanda Pazham” by Srimati L R Eashwari has a later Hindi version By Ashaji” Ber Lo Ber Lo”. also ” Maadi Mele Maadi Katti…….. Vishwanathan Velai Vendum” in Kathal Enna Kathrikaya has a later Hindi Version” Ram Lal Murdabad” in Pyar Kiye Ja. Do they fit into this category?
@ Lakshmi Srinivas
Thank you very much for your nice comments. ‘way to go’. Appropriately put. Both the songs you have mentioned in your comment #33 and the first song you have mentioned in comment #35 are from remakes and will be part of my 3rd write-up. But as regards the Hindi version of ‘Vishwanthan velai vendum’, the song situation/sequence is similar, but the tune is not the same. So this song does not fit into any of my 3 categories.
While writing this article I was looking for two things. One, I wanted somebody to put up a Hindi film Song inspired and copied from Tamil film song. That is yet to happen. The second one, I was expecting somebody, who is new to Songs of Yore. Welcome to Songs of yore. You should visit the other articles written by my learned predecessors AK ji (we are his guests), Subodh Agarwalji, Ashok Vaishnavji and Arun Kumar Deshmukhji. I am sure you will be enlightened and enjoy their learned discourse. Hope to see your name often.
Thanks once again.
@ Venkataraman,
I enjoyed all the tamil songs though let me tell you I cannot understand a word of it.
Vyjantimala’s dance is so graceful, her grace makes the inspired version of chup chup khade ho sounds better than the original.
A related query. Which song spawned the most adaptations in Indian films? My guess Carmen Miranda’s ‘I like you very much’.
Jignesh, grinning at the thought of someone finding Malayalam ‘easy’. 🙂 I don’t recognise the songs you posted, unfortunately. I don’t know if the songs you listed are new ones? If so, it is very unlikely that I would know them since, unless someone tells me that a particular film’s songs are good, I wouldn’t know about them at all. Ask me about any song pre-80s and I should (mostly) be able to help you.
Gaddeswarup
Or possibly ‘Come September’?
AK Ji,
I wonder whether this reflects the age difference between us ( I am nearly 72) and my very sketchy knowledge of only 40s and 50s songs. I do not know many later ones though Atul’s blog helps.
Let me confess ,since the moment I visited this sight, it has become a major preoccupation with me. So yesterday as I was about to hit the sack I remembered the song “Ammavum Neeye Appavum Neeye” from “Kalathur Kannamma” in which Kamal Haasan made his debut as a child artist. The Hindi version is “Tum hi maata pita tumhi ho”. I am not sure about the Hindi movie.
Yes I definitely intend visiting all the various segments of this site. They look very interesting and tempting. Honestly, it can be addictive.
Thanks for the suggestion
Gaddeswarupji,
Mine ends at 60s. My own preference is towards still earlier period. At least with people of your generation we have the advantage of first hand experience.
I have to specially thank you for the Missiamma clip. First the cover version of Shanta Apte’s Har gali mein hain bageeche from 1937, ending with my favourite in Durga. Earlier Mr Venkataraman had introduced me to the Tamil version of Brindavan ka Krishna Kanhaiya. And now the Telugu version. Could anyone ask for more?
(I am curious, why is the comedian disturbing Savitri in her singing? It is irritating.)
Another Shanta Apte song from Amar Jyoti 1936
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BV2P9nYjzSw#!
Similar Tamil song from Chintamani 1937
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3gFEXyJeDn4
AK Ji,
He requested Savitri to teach Jamuna since he was afraid of loosing Jamuna to the other teacher (Gemini Ganesh in Tamil and NTR in Telugu). Instead Savitei offered to teach the comedian so that hecould go back and teach Jamuna. We see the result.
I think that there was lot of northern influence on Tamil cinema in the early days and it slowly decreased. There is a discussion in Stephen Putnam Hughes “What is Tamil about Tamil Cinema?”, in South Asian Popular Culture, vol.8, no.3. October 2010,213-219
But my reading and listening to songs is rather desultory. I think that some Tamilian professor in Australia has a book on the later politics and changes.
Gaddeswarupji,
Good Heavens! Shanta Apte’s Suno suno ban ke prani in Tamil. Thank s a lot. Who is the lady? Does not look like Shant Apte. The YT comment says Shanta Apte acted in Tamil movie Savitri (1941). This is really a great heritage song. Thanks to the uploader. I hope YT do not remove it!
Thanks for your clarification about the Missiamma song.
AKJi,
The Tamil song was by different person. Shanta Apte did sing in the Tamil film Savithri.
AK Ji,
I meant the Tamil song tune is similar to the earlier Shanta Apte song. Here is one of Shanta Apte Tamil songs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBOOPGzfMlg
Liked it. I would have thoguht of Shanta Apte only in the context of Hindi-Marathi. Thanks.
Gaddeswarup ji,
I was following your discussion with AKji. Simply superb. The participation of people like you helps us to enhance our knowledge and add lustre to SoY.
The double version songs from Amar Jyothi and Chintamani were fantastic. This must be the oldest Double version songs posted till now.
Akji has rightly pointed that the actress does not look like Shantha Apte. Aswatthamma, famous Kannada actress and singer was engaged in this movie. She acted and sung in one more Tamil movie, before she met with premature death (probably in 1939) due to tuberculosis.
Vekataraman Ji,
My knowledge of film songs is very limited. Shanta Apte is a famous name from childhood and I started listening to her songs again only last year intrigued by her personality and the fact that she was not a trained singer and considered unsuitable for singing. I am sure Arunkumar Ji will have much more information on her songs and story.
I believe Amar Jyoti also had Marathi version. So is it possible that some of Shanta Apte’s songs are treble or quadrapule version? Hindi-Marathi-Tamil-Telugu? That would be a fascinating subject – multiple version spanning 3 or more languages.
AK Ji,
I am not sure that there is a Marathi version of Amar Jyoti. It was not mentioned in the earlier post of Shri Arumkumar Deshmukh. Also I do not know any Telugu songs by Shanta Apte, though according to a Cineplot article, she knew Telugu. Some of her songs must have been adapted, I heard of one by Kannambe which was based on one from Gopalkrishna. But there must be some Indian songs which had versions in 3-4 languages.
AKji and Gaddeswarupji,
There is some confusion. In the comment#44, Gaddewarupji had presented a Shanta Apte song from Amar Jyoti 1936 and a similar Tamil song from Chintamani 1937. The film Chintamani was not a remake of Amar Jyoti. Gaddeswaroopji had clarified that the Tamil version was not sung by Shanta Apte (comment #47) (actually sung by Aswtthamma). He presented another Tamil song sung by Shanta Apte (comment #48) from the Tamil film Savitri (1941). I am not sure whether Savitri had any Hindi or Marathi versions. But Amar Jyothi has both Hindi and Marathi versions.
That’s what I thought. Therefore, I call upon the Masters to do a post on multiple version songs across multiple languages.
A dumb question. Since Azaad is a remake of Mallaikallan (?), are there songs with similar tunes? I could not find any.
Venkatraman ji,
The Tamil film’ Savitri’-1941 had no Hindi or Marathi remake.This film was actually inspired by the Bombay Talkies’ film ” Savitri “-1937,in which Devika Rani and Ashok Kumar had acted.There was also another film ‘Savitri’ in 1933,made at Calcutta by the East India film co.
Tamil film Savitri had total 18 songs as follows-
Shanta Apte-solos-8, Duets- 2 (with the Director Hero”Satyavan” played by Y.V.Rao or Yellapudi Venkateshwara Rao) Total 10 songs.
M S Subbulaxmi- 6 Solos
Chinniah(as Yama) 1 solo
Comedy pair -Menaka and Vinoth- 1 Duet.
I think ALL songs must be available on the Net at different places.
-AD
Akji,
Not at all a dump question. Malaikallan (1954), the Tamil movie was produced and directed by S M Sreeramulu Naidu. The story was written by Namakkal Va Ramalinga Pillai, inspired by and based on the English novel ‘Robi Hood and mark of Zorro. Now comes the interesting part. This movie was simultaneously produced in (hold your breath) in 6 (six) languages and all the six version were, to use the
Tamilians’ expression, super duper hit. Music for the South Indian versions was composed by C Subbaih Naidu and for the Hindi version, as we all know, was by C Ramachandra. There may be similar tunes in the South Indian versions, but none of the South Indian Melodies were repeated in the Hindi version. I had planned to touch upon this subject in my 3rd part. Since you have raised a pertinent question I am bound give the answer here!!!
Gadde swarup ji,
That means 2 hindi versions on the same topic/theme, one in 1933 from Calcutta, the other in 1937 from Bombay, followed by the Tamil version in 1941 from Madras. Great. Thank you for the information.
Akji
I am holding back the names of the six versions, so as maintain the element of surprise? Not that somebody mayl dig it out from the net and post it. The child in me refuses to part! Already many of the songs, which I had in my list (short) for the 3rd part, has come up in this post.
Venkatraman ji,
There is just a slight correction .
Malai Kallan was made in 6 languages is correct,but all the films were NOT made simulteneously.They were made at different times. The sets were kept intact,I think,in Coimbtore,for Azaad.The producers went to Bombay to fix up, initially Naushad as MD,but later settled for C.Ramchandra.
-AD
Gaddeswarupji,
You are right. I stand corrected. I think they were made between 1954 and 1955. Thank you.
How C Ramachandra got to compose music for Azad was discussed by AKji in his article ‘The Best Songs of 1955- and the winner are’.
Thank you once again
Venkatraman ji,
I do hope that you are not displeased with me terribly as to not even take my name !
For 2 of MY comments,you have replied as ‘Gaddeswaprup ji’
-Arunkumar Deshmukh
There is another Hindi film Devta1956, with some very nice songs, which is a remake of a Tamil film
http://www.thehindu.com/features/cinema/blast-from-the-past-kanavaney-kankanda-deivam/article73473.ece
I do not know whether there are similar songs except that one of the Tamil songs had the song and hiccups by different persons. I think C. Ramachandra introduced hiccups in songs in an earlier film
Gaddeswarup ji,
Hiccups were indeed introduced by C.Ramchandra in the song
” jamana ye samajha ke hum peeke aaye”-Anarkali-1953(Lata).
-AD
Arunji,
I am extremely sorry for the oversight. I was trying to do some multitasking and hence the mix-up. But that cannot be an excuse. In fact I should be ashamed. People like you and Gaddeswaroopji are ‘Rishitulya Vyakti’ as far as Hindi films and Indian films are concerned. My sincere apologies to both of you. Thank you for all those educative information.
Gaddeswarupji,
I went through the clipping on ‘Kanavane Kan Kanda Deivam’. I was under the impression that ‘Devta’ and the Malayalam version were remakes. But this clipping says that they were dubbed from the Tamil original. I was aware of this song and had kept it in my short list on remakes. I will watch it on YT and include it in my next article. Thank you.
Be karats an Ji,
Please do not take my comments too seriously; I mainly comment to learn more. I enjoy film songs very much. I am also biased towards film songs since I feel that it is one medium which catered to the common man without specialized knowledge of music. All these posts are proving to be a wonderful mine for finding many of those attractive songs and I am grateful to people like you who are taking the trouble to research and post about these. Many thanks.
Oops, google changed the spelling and I did not notice. Vrnkataramanji, my apologies for the typos. Some are from google but I did not check carefully.
Venkatji seems to have done this piece with great passion. He has gone to a great extent on the subject. I look forward to his next installment.
@Alokes Roy,
Intense passion initially gives ecstasy, but ultimately leads to love (for the subject). But expression (of this resultant love) and performance comes from experience. Thank you for visiting my article. Hope you will find time to got through the other articles in this site and post your comments.
Thanks once again
Here are two songs. The Tamizh song from the film ‘Bhagapiravinai’ (1959) sung by T M Sounderarajan and P Leela, lyrics Kavignar Kannadasan, music M S Vishwanathan – T K Ramamoothy, was based on Keralian Folk; whereas the Hindi Song from the film ‘Sujata’ (1959) sung and composed by S D Burman, lyrics Majrooh Sultanpuri, was based on Bengali folk. Strictly speaking, I cannot call this an Tamil remake of a Hindi song. But there is a close resemblance between the two songs. But it very often happens in case folk songs of two different regions. Let us listen to the Tamil song first and then the Hindi song.
Sun mere bandhu re by SD Burman from Sujata
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=At-AEaBGOjQ
Dear Venkatramanji,
What a splendid work you have done. I am enthralled with the songs in Tamil.
I am also impressed by the research you have done to bring the versions of hindi and south Indian songs. Well as it is said, music has no barrier even of language!
Keep the good work. I look forward to some more of your research work in all the South Indian Languages and the twin versions in Hindi language.
I am happy that I have known you and your work through Songs of Yore.
My namaskaram to you!
Kuldeep Chauhan
Venkataramanji,
I have been participating in a Tamil site since 2005 even though I do not know Tamil (I studied in Madras in the fifties and know a few words). In a recent thread one Rajraj has posted some songs with similar ones in Tamil and Telugu, the latest on page 114
http://www.mayyam.com/talk/showthread.php?4695-Hindi-songs-of-Emotional-Impact-nostalgic-favorites-etc/page114
If you back in this thread, there may be some new ones.
Gaddeswarupji,
You have given link to a wonderful forum. One could spend endless hours there. Thanks a lot.
Kuldeep Chauhanji,
I am happy that you enjoyed this article. Thank you very much for your appreciation and encouragement.
I would call my endeavour a compilation, of songs collected from YT and the relevant information collected from various sources, rather than research. YT and the internet has provided immense scope for such pursuits.
After completion of my three part journey on Tamil Versions, I will decide on the other South Indian Language Songs. I will have to consult AKji, our competent coach and conductor, on this matter.
We, the members of SoY are also happy to have you as our company in this journey.
Gaddeswarupji,
Thank you for introducing me to this thread. I will go through this thread at leisure. Hope to find some useful information and links. The song, on page 114 of this thread, will fit into this category/article.
The Tamil song “Aram Kaatha Dheviye” by A M Rajaj and Jikki from the film ‘Maheshwari’ (1955), lyrics Pattukottai Kalyansundaram, Music G Ramanathan was inspired by and adopted from the Hindi song “Gagan Jhanjhana Rahaa” by Hemant Kumar and Lata Mangeshkar from the film ‘Nastik’ (1954), lyrics Kavi Pradeep, music C Ramachandra.
Excellent article, Venkatramanji. Truly a passionate and detailed piece of work. Please educate us with more of topics and analysis.
@pushan
Thank you for your nice comments. Hope you will be a regular visitor to SoY. I have developed an affinity to this site. Although Akji is the host, I take the liberty to invite you on his behalf.
Welcome aboard.
Here is another quote from M S Vishwanathan’ interview with Sriram Lakshman:
“Have you heard ‘poomAlayil Or malligai’?“ is the question he (MSV) interrupts the flow with. Oh of course !!! He goes onto sing the pallavi of “thoo mera chand main theri chandni” again, composed by Naushad. He follows this by singing the swarams from the flute interlude of the Hindi Song. There seems to be this familiar twist to this phrase and it reminds one of…..the “shake” in the pallavi of “poomalayil or malligai”…..at the word “poomAlayil”. He goes on, “ithu thaan composing” (this is Composing) with a mischevious glint in his eyes. I marveled at how a simple twist could lay the foundation for a “melody” strong duet that would warm the bosoms of even the greatest music haters.
“thoo mera chand main theri chandni” from the fim Dillagi (1949) by Shyam and Suraiya, lyrics Shakeel Badayuni, music Naushad.
Listen to the flute interlude starting at 0:39 and again at 1:56
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InUbZ1ee8hM
Now listen to the Tamil song based on this flute interlude (tune)
“Poomaalayil’ from the film Ooty varai uravu (1961) by T M Sounderarajan and P Susheela, lyrics Kannadasan, music M S Vishwantahan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHR0BfPNF7U
It is impossible for me to differentiate between south indian languages.
but I saw this song on you tube tube and found it fit for this article.
http://www.liketamil.com/video/5349/one-melody-different-singers-languages-yaar-nee-1966-woh-kaun-thi-1964
@ mumbaikar8
Thank you. Akji too had mentioned about this earlier. Actually this film ‘Woh Kaun Thi’ was remade in Tamil.
While working on Tamil version songs from remake movies , I came across two more Tamil songs ‘Inspired and adopted’ from Hindi movies.
The first song
Raadhayin nenjame Kannanukku sondhame byP Susheela from Kanimutthu Papa (1972), lyrics Kavignar Kannadasan, music T V Raju
Khil te hain gul yaha by Kishore kumar from Sharmilee( 1971), lyrics Neeraj, music S D Burman
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBgKPyi1aXA
Lata Mangeshkar version
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnUR0ZIzd88
The second song
Naan Malarodu Thaniyaga by P Susheela and T M Sounderarajan from Iru Vallavargal (1966), lyrics Kavignar Kannadasan, music Veda
Tuje pyar karte hai karte rahenge by Suman Kalyanpur and Md.Rafi from April fool(1964), lyrics Hasrat Jaipuri , music Shankar Jaikishan
Sir,
I would like to know the details of tamil version of hindi film Anuraag song “Sunri pawan pavan pur vaiyya”
Mr D S Arvind
I was not aware of the Tamil version of the song ‘Sun ri Pawan Pawan Puruvaiya’. Are you sure? I will try to find out.
The original version of this song is a Bengali Song which Akji will cover in his article on this subject.
venkataramanji, well this songs mukhda is taken from ‘ruk ja o janewali ruk ja’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9I1Z6O_mbw
”’sau baar janam lenge, sau baar fana honge”’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9muhp0Upuc
Shri Venkataramanji,
I am sure that there is a Tamil version of hindi song “Sunri Pawan Pawan Purvaiyya”, which I have heard in 1975.
Jignesh,
The mukhda of the Tamil song you have mentioned (#84),is similar to ‘ruk ja o janewali ruk ja’. The Hindi song was from the golden era of Indian films and the Tamil song is from modern period. Nice song.
The Tamil version of ‘sau baar janam lenge, sau baar fana honge’ was from the Tamil remake of the Hindi film Ustadon Ka Ustad. I am aware of this and you will find this in my article on ‘Songs from remakes’ (3rd part). The music director of the Tamil remake Veda had retained the original Hindi tune. There are few songs in this Tamil film which were adopted from other Hindi movies of earlier period.
Thank you
Mr. D S Arvind,
I will be on the lookout for this Tamil version of ‘Sun ri Pawan Pawan Puruvaiya’. Please keep visiting SoY.
Thank you.
@Arunkumar Deshmukh,
Here’s the tamil version of the song. Took some effort searching for it on Youtube!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCr50-iwwzE
Minor correction – 10H. Dil pukare aa re aa re aa re by Md Rafi and Lata Mangeshkar, not Asha Bhosle
@naras
Thank you for pointing out the error . I would request AKji to make the correction.
Since corrected. Thanks Naras. I should have also noticed it.
naras ji,
Thanks for providing link to the original Tamil song,which was copied in Telugu and Hindi subsequently. (your comment No 89,here).
It is simply divine.
Thanks once again.
-AD
I am not sure whether this is mentioned already. Rajraj posted it recently in the Hub
Gaddeswarupji,
What a fantastic song you have presented. The original by Chitalkar and Shamshad Begum is by itself out of this world. But I am now confused whether I like Tamil (?) version more. The picturisation on the small girl and her music teacher (?) is too cute. Thanks a lot.
O dilwalo dil ka lagana achchha hai par kabhi kabhi from Patanga (1949)
AKji,
That forum has some very knowledgeable people, more so a few years ago. They tolerate a lot of rubbish too and some like Aravindhan have quit. He did not post about music but about India in general, some of the best blog posts I have seen. They also seem to welcome and tolerate outsiders like me, just as you have done. Regards,
Swarup
Gaddeswarupji,
I saw Digambara Samiyaar long time back. I remembered this film for two reasons. One, M N Nambiar, who was the eternal villain in Tamil movies, played the leading role and put on 10 disguises in this movie. He became very popular for his role in this movie. Secondly, this movie had three dance sequences, featuring two of the Travancore sisters Lalitha and Padmini in two and Kumari Kamala in the other dance sequence. There was one more song featuring Lalitha and Padmini.
But I do not remember hearing this song posted by you. Thank you for posting this marvelous song.
I think this song was rendered by Gajalakshmi and Master Subbaiyya and the music was composed by G Ramanathan and S M Subaiyya Naidu. The cute little girl was Baby Lalitha. The old man was the grandfather of the would be bride of the brother of this cute girl.
Thanks to Akji for posting the equally wonderful Hindi Original.
AKji and Venkataramanji,
There is a similar song in Telugu too from the film Agni Pareekshna (1951). It does not seem to be as lively as the Tamil version and I could not find a video. The information is from Sreenivas Paruchuri, one of the most erudite persons on Indology topics that I know. It is the fourth song in the link below
http://desitunes.desibantu.com/agnipareeksha
Gaddeswarupji,
Thank you for providing this link. It is quite interesting and one can spend hours listening to the songs.
You are right, the Tamil version is more lively, but the Telugu version is also good.
I was browsing quickly through some of the songs and found that the song #1 in this link is an adaption of ‘Hawa mein udta Jaye’ and I am sure there must be a Tamil version of this song. We already have a Oriya version of this song posted by Mr.Veda.
The song #8 is Telugu version of ‘Mein bhanwara tu hai phool’. You will find the Tamil Version and the Hindi original in song 2t and 2h of this post.
Ashok Vaishnavji had said earlier, the more you dive one would find more gems. More people, especially veterans like you, joining the drive, I am sure many more gems will be unearthed.
Venkataramanji, Gaddeswarupji
I also tried to listen to all the links. I just wanted confirmation from you that the links no 11 to 21 did not play. May be the songs are not linked, because the entries say ‘awaiting contribution’.
Meanwhile I was also able to figure out #10. It is Telugu version of Hum dard ka afsana duniya ko dikha dengue by Sahmshad Begum from Dard (1947). So this one link has given four Hindi-Telugu songs. I hope some erudite reader is reading this, and we would have someone write on Hindi-Telugu – I am sure there would be enough material for a post.
AK ji,
The songs 11 onwards are ‘awaiting contribution’. Sreenivas Paruchuri said that several of the songs in the film are copies from Hindi tunes. He is one of the organizers of a site oldtelugusongs but generally they omitted copied tunes. There are more sites now and I usually finds songs that I want if I search long enough. But now I have found many Telugu songs I remember from the forties, I am not searching too hard. If I have doubts I usually ask Sreenivas but these days I do not like to trouble him because he is shuttling between Germany and UK and also busy with work and research as a plastics engineer.
I looked at more sites
http://pathabangaram.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=10453
and
http://www.sakhiyaa.com/
There is not much more information. Some older persons like V.A.K. Rangarao know and some like Paruchuri Sreenivas are only in their early forties. I guess that it is a matter of luck finding these things. Sometimes popular tunes in one language are not so well remembered when copied. Possibly there are various factors like what suited the particular culture. For example, Ghantasala is still popular in Telugu but probably not so much in Tamil (apparently he did not pronounce well certain sounds). In Hindi, even in films where he was MD, he used other singers. Bhanumati was versatile and she sang her own songs in the Hindi films that she produced but not in others.
Akji, Gaddeswarupji,
I thought of asking you to request Mr. Sreenivas Paruchri to do the post on Telugu. But it seems it will not be possible because of his preoccupations. I have a few Telugu-Hindi version songs and I will try to get a few more. We can then discuss how to go about it. Hope in the mean time somebody more knowledgeable will come up to do the post.
Let us play by the ear, and see how best we can go about it. We can discuss it on email.
what about the tamil song ” Naan malorodu thaniyaga yen ingu nindren, yen maharani unnai kaana ododi vanthen ” and the hindi one ” tumhen pyaar karte hain, karte rahenge “
Rajani
This is a fabulous song. Thanks for mentioning this song. I do not know whether this fits here or in two other themes by Venkataramanji to follow.
Naan malorudu thangiya yen from Iru Vallavargal
The Hindi duet is also my top favourite:
Tujhe pyar karte hain karte rahenge by Rafi and Suman Kalyanpur from April Fool, music by Shankar Jaikishan
Rajaniji,
Thank you for spending some of your valuable time to visit SoY and the post on ‘Inspired and adopted songs’. I would kindly request you to go through the comments section and also other articles in SoY. I am sure you will enjoy them too.
Indeed, both the versions of the said song are fabulous and fit in this category. You will find both the versions in comment #81. Thank you once again
Here are some of my own contributions to this fantastic post on Tamil songs inspired & adopted from hindi-
1) PORULEY from Parasakthi (1952)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtzgqqJgJ8Y
Hindi original from Babul (1950)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScQM1ENRS6w
2) Nilavo Aval irulo from Arunagirinathar (1964)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1O1oksFKmI
Hindi original from Maya (1961)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAd5Bj9CVog
Both the Tamil version songs were new to me. Naushad was very much respected and popular in South. Earlier we have found that MD R Sudharshanam of AVM had adopted quite a few Hindi numbers. The song was rendered by T S Bhagavathi and the lyric was penned by the M Karunanidhi, the former CM of TN.
But the second one was a surprise. Salil Choudhury had used his own tune in more than one language.. But this is the first time I am finding his tune being adopted in another language by another MD. To quote AKji’s words; ‘they were also very eclectic, taking from wherever that took their fancy!’
Here is the Bengali version sung by Lata Mangeshkar to the tune of Salil Choudhury.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhXbqQgioMI
Thank you Raunak for unearthing these songs
Another instance of Salilda’ s tune being adopted by another MD is the sri lankan song ‘Dakina Dakina Wele’ from the original bengali number ‘Dhitang Dhitang Bole’.
Coming back to Tamil songs adopted from Hindi numbers, probably the first hindi song to have been adopted in Tamil was the classic Pankaj Mullick number ‘Piya Milan Ko Jana’. The Tamil version of the song is from the 1942 movie ‘Ashok Kumar’-Link Below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5LSUymYDog
Indeed the Pankaj Mullick number has been adopted not once, not twice but thrice in Tamil!! The below youtube link mentions all the 3 tamil versions-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN-kiAlOcRs
The original Pankajda number-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDGQF39XRIY
And no need for thanks Sir.. It’s your wonderful posts here that inspired me to unearth these songs… By the way i am the same raunak, who did a series of posts on Manna Dey & his bengali songs..
Raunak,
This is wonderful. I especially liked the version in the film Ashok Kumar (1942). An unusual name for a movie! It could not have been Emperor Ashok, nor the film star Ashok Kumar. Can anyone some throw light on this?
Raunak,
I do remember you, Thank you for your comments and additions.
Although I knew that song Piya Milan ko jana had a Tamil version sung by M K Thyagaraja Bhagavathar, While doing this post, I could not recollect the words nor I could locate the song in YT. The songs from Sannyasi (1942) and Seetha Janam (1941) were new to me. All the songs are fantastic additions. Sach much aapne is post ka Raunak bada diya.
I think the Malayalam adoption was discussed by Anuji in her post on Malayalam version songs (song No.8).
Akji,
I gathered from WEB that the film was based on an ancient folktale connected with Mauryan Emperor Ashoka’s son Kunal. The Mauryan prince Kunal was courted by Ashoka’s younger queen Tishyarakshita and when he rejected her advances, was falsely accused by the queen of trying to seduce her and was thrown into prison and blinded. The story, however, comes to a happy end with his eyesight being restored by Lord Buddha and the king acquits of all the charges.
What a lovely subject ! How about poo pola poo pola sirikumm in tamil and its Hindi equivalent chandha se jhoomega …I am not sure though ..vague memory !
Viji ji,
Welcome to SoY. You are right. This song is from a Tamil to Hindi remake film and it will be covered in the last and fifth part of the series, ‘Songs from remakes-Tamil to Hindi’. Besides this post there are three more posts, which are part of The Multiple-Version song series of SoY.
On the right hand side of this blog (Songs of Yore), under the Category ‘Songs on themes’ you will find the caption “Multiple version songs’, where there are 15 posts on this theme. Posts #5, #8, #13 and #15 are on Tamil songs. You may also visit the other posts too, and I am sure you will find them interesting.
Thanks for your appreciation.
Ok! Just discovering this page ..awesome and analytical !
Thanks for all the leads to enjoy this blog !
Mr. Nanjappa,
Here is the link to the Tamil and the Hindi versions of the song mentioned by you. This is a song inspired from a Hindi film and adopted in a Tamil movie. Hence I have posted it here.
3T. Porule Illaarkku by T S Bhagavathi, film Parasakthi (1952), lyrics M Karunanidhi (?), music R Sudarshanam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3q1dmGI3OBE
3H. Miltehi aankhen dil huva’ by Talat and Shamshad, Babul (1950), Shakeel badayuni, Naushad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXFURlgbMF0
Five lyricists wrote 11 songs for this film. They were Kannadasan, Bharathidasan, T. N. Ramaiah Nadu, Bharathiyar, M. Karunanidhi and Udumalai Narayana Kavi. I am not sure who penned this song. Do you have any idea?
Thank for introducing this song.
vekataraman ji
have you seen the film kaakum karangal and its song poopola poopala pirakkum.?
same song here in main bhi ladki hum
directed by a c tri log chander
dubbed naanum oru penn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2hndnspKeA
please comment.
Mr Vishwanthan,
Yes, I have seen this film (Tamil).
This film is a remake from Tamil to Hindi and not a dubbed film. As such songs from this film will form a part of my next post “Multiple version songs – Tamil to Hindi’. This song is very much in my list.
Thanks
Mr. Vishwanthan,
Sorry. I did not get your question right.
Did you mean the song Poopola Poopola pirakkum was from the film Kakkum Karangal? I have not watched the film Kaakkum Karangal. Are you sure the said song is also in Kaakkum karangal.
I have seen the film Naanum oru penn and the above mentioned song is very much part of this film. You mean to say that the song was repeated from Kaakkum Karangal with same tune in Naanum orun Penn.
Main bhi ladki hoon is the remake of Naanum oru penn.
Please clarify.
venkatraman ji
the song poopola poopola pirakkum is not from kaakum karangal but from naanum oru penn only. i m sorry i mistook it.
anyway a song from kaakum karangal seems to have hindi version
gnayiru enbathu http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGppVFnr-Vc
pls. clarify
Mr.Vishwanthan,
Gnayiru enbathu is a nice song. Although the tune seems to be familiar, may be Harry Belafonte’s song, I am not able to pinpoint. I cannot recollect any Hindi version of this song. SSW or some other knowledgeable listener can help.
Here is another nice number inspired by a Hindi song
Intha maniathai paarai maghane by P B Srinivas and P Susheela, film Kalyanikku Kalyanam (1959), lyrics (?) , music G Ramanathan
http://www.inbaminge.com/t/k/Kalyanikku%20Kalyanam/Intha%20Maanil%20Athai.eng.html
the Hindi original, one of the beautiful compositions of S N tripathi
Zara samne to aawo by Md.Rafi and Lata Mangeshkar, from Janam Janam ke phere (1957), lyrics, music S N Tripathi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtX8KCqGp7Q
venkataraman ji
here is a nice song
oadam nadhyinele
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mq3DDO7gNYg
similar song is in sujatha hindi http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5etF2Rh8eQ
am i right ?
please comment.
with high regards for your knowledge in this fileld.
Mr Vishwanathan,
Odham Nathiyinile is indeed a nice song and it has similarities with Sun mere bandhu re. But I am not sure whether you can consider it as an adaption. Very often the folk songs of one region have similarities with similar folk songs of other regions.
Sun mere bandhu re was based on Bhatiyali, songs sung by boatmen of East Bengal. A range of emotions are expressed by the boatman/men. Like the surge and ebb of the river, the theme varies between happiness and sorrow. The original Bengali song was Tomar Laagiya re, Pran amaar kande re. There are some nice songs based on folk tune in the film Bhaga Privinai, too.
Thank You.
Venkatji,
This is interesting. You are spot on when you rightly mention that folks songs of one region have similarities with similar folk songs of other regions. But still I have a feeling that ‘Odham Nathiyinile’ could have been influenced by Sun mere Bandhu or Bengali folk as the tamil song is from the film ‘Kathirundha Kangal’, which was a remake of the bengali film ‘Smriti Tuku Thak’. From what i have seen, back in the 50’s and 60’s, South films remade from Bengali films or adapted from Bangla novels, would often bore a clear bengali influence in the settings, dialogue,music and rarely even costumes .Would like to know your thoughts on this, Venkatji, especially in the context of Odham Nathiyinile/Sun Mere Bandhu.
Raunak,
The Odham Nathiyinile could have been influenced by Sun mere bandhu re. I cannot emphatically say that it was influenced some Tamil folk.
I was not aware that the film was a remake of the Bengali film Smriti tuku Thak. Thanks for the information.
Mr.Venkataraman and Mr.Vishwanathan,
The song you mentioned
gnayiru enbathu http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGppVFnr-Vc
seems to be related superficially to this old American song…There are many versions, this is one of the more famous ones.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZYjc57V55U
The melodic structure of both songs is similar. Gyaniru enbathu has some chord differences , the anupallavi (antara) has differences. But the melody of the American song itself is not original. There are many songs which are based on the same structure so it is possible that the inspiration came from some other similar song too.
I’m a bit curious about folk music and if you are too here is some information about the Tom Dooley ballad.
http://www.kingstontrioplace.com/tdooleydoc.htm
To follow up, I was thinking exactly as Mr. Venkataraman mentioned that the song gyaniru enbathu had a calypso lilt which characterised the Tom Dooley recording by the Kingston Trio. So there is this Harry Belafonte song sung by convicts on an island while harvesting bananas…It has the same lilt..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMigXnXMhQ4
Many influences eh?
Correction, those aren’t convicts but dock workers loading bananas in Jamaica. My memory is getting mixed up.
Two versions of ‘Oomai pennallo’ for the Tamil classic ‘Paarthaal Pasi Theerum’ (1962, MD- Viswanathan-Ramamoorthy):
First, the solo version by P.Suseela:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vo2GLz4JHh8
BTW, the child actor is Kamal Hassan.
Second, the duet version by P.Suseela and A.L.Raghavan:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkNDSqzdMrU
Now, for the ‘inspired’ copy from ‘Seeta Aur Geeta’ sung by Manna Dey and Asha Bhonsle (1972, MD – Kalyanji-Anandji):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Jzyd6EY15A
P. Suseela doing playback of the Tamil version of ‘Naina barse’ for Jayalalitha in ‘Yaar Nee?’, the Tamil remake of ‘Woh Kaun Thi?’. The song has been uploaded in 3 parts as Part 1, Part 2 and Part 3. to YT. Comparing the song to its Hindi equivalent, it seems to me that the right order ought to be Part 3, Part 2 and Part 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVURcn3-5c0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wC9iMgrHQsQ&spfreload=1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssf59WMNfA4
The dubbed versions of the songs from ‘Udan Khatola’ (‘Vaanaratham’). Those who understand both languages will note that the Tamil lyrics (by Kannadasan) are more or less exact translations of the Hindi originals
1. ‘Ennai kande povaai’/’Mera salaam le ja’:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nMTgYbyvGs
2. ‘Enthan Kannaalan’/’More saiyaanji’
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFHMUuw0NRw
3. ‘En ullam vittu odaathe’/’Hamaare dil se na jaana’:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmIqHRR01-Q
4. While the songs cited above have all been sung by Lata, the Tamil version of ‘Na toofaan se khelo’ has not been sung by Rafi, but by T.A.Mothi.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-tJTab9480
An interesting interview with R.Balasaraswati regarding her tryst with these songs has been reproduced towards the middle of the following page: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.music.indian.misc/xbcbN0Sx6U8.
Ashwin Bhandarkar ji,
Thanks for the visiting the post and for the additions. It seems you have an interest in Tamil films too. You might have noticed that there are three more posts on Hindi-Tamil version songs. You may visit them. Here are the links.
Multiple Version Songs (8): Hindi-Tamil Film Songs (2) Songs From Dubbed Versions
Multiple Version Songs (13): Hindi And Tamil Film Songs (3) – Dance (R) S Of Deccan
Multiple Version Songs (15): In The ‘Realm Of Remakes’ – Hindi To Tamil
Sorry for the delayed response.
Sorry, Her are the links
https://www.songsofyore.com/hindi-film-songs-dubbed-in-tamil-films/
https://www.songsofyore.com/south-indian-dancers-and-dances-in-hindi-films/
https://www.songsofyore.com/multiple-version-songs-15-in-the-realm-of-remakes-hindi-to-tamil/
Venkatramanji,
Thanks for the links! Will look them up at leisure. A little secret – I grew up in Chennai in the 70’s and early 80’s, when it was Madras and yet to become Chennai, and I can read, write and speak Tamil :). (I can even write it laterally inverted, which I suppose not many Tamilians can claim to do!) However, possibly because of the influences at home, my exposure in music has largely been confined to Hindustani classical music (which I learnt for 14 years … in Madras) and related genres, and of course HFM.
I have a few more songs which are rhyming : Hindi & Tamil
1. Sau baar janam lenge / Orayiram parvaiyile
2. Naina bar se rimjim / Naane varuven
3. Yeh Zindagi gale lage le / En vazhvile varum anbe vaa
I can give the name of the movies , singers and the links if possible if somebody is interested
KK
HELLO VENKATARAMAN
I created a play list of around 405 sets of copied/inspired Hindi Tamil songs for the benefit of old songs lovers:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLgRuXAKstaZhLyqqw8xMy4Qk3FjFn5qfk
You may please have a glance at it
Respected Sir
Can you mention the equal hindhi tune song of Tamil THANGAPADAKKAM SONG ‘Sumaithangisaiyndal sumai yennavaagum’ .
Thanking you
Leena.B
Hello:
Is there a “Hebbar Tamil” song rendered based on same tune as aa laut ke aaja mere meet?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtDiFqKllh8&lc=z23qtfrihv3qsxlvpacdp43ai0ldoh53kbk5dbrpohlw03c010c
Mr.Balu Nadig
Welcome to SoY.
Not to my knowledge. Sorry to disappoint you.
Tamil version Kumudam
You can Google search
You will get all details
Possibly full movie
Great effort
You made my day
I just reviewed a part of 1 of 4
Need to check all
Thanks Mr Venkataraman
Appreciate your efforts
Great job
Raghu,
Welcome to Songs of Yore.
Mr.Raghu,
Thank you for the appreciations. I hope you have gone through all the four posts.
Not yet
I am based in Canada
I don’t know hindi My wife not that comfortable with Tamil
We get opportunities to sing in karaoke sessions
Looking for these kind of websites so that we can sing duets
Appreciate your efforts
I gone through all Comments to know the original version of Tamil song “Brinthavanathil poo” film CID Sankar
Anyone who knows please comment
Please please
Dear sir
You have mentioned
Vazhkkai,Nau Jawan and many other
films but failed to mention Ali baba aur
Chalis chor made in 1954 remade as Alibabavum
Naarpathu Thirudargalum.It is significant
to note that TR Sundaram,producer director
asked Udumalai Narayana Kavi to virtually copy
the Hindi songs which Kavi refused
A Marutha Kasi did the copying job of the tunes
The song Ai Saba unse Keh Zara was totally copied as Masilaa unmai kaadhale as also many
other songs in the film.Raja mehdi khan had written the lyrics while both SN Tripathi and Chitragupt gave the music.It is a travesty that both Marutha Kasi and Susarla Kakshinsmoorthy
got all the credit.Do sad
Ravi Shastri,
Welcome to SOY and thanks a lot for your highly informative comments.
Mr.Ravi Shastri,
@ 147
Thanks for visiting SoY and my post.
Thanks too for mentioning the songs.
Probably you missed the opening part of this post (2nd Paragraph).
“My maiden attempt will delve into Tamil film songs only. I have further classified the subject into 3 sub-categories. ‘Inspired and adopted melodies’ in the first part, ‘Songs from dubbed versions’ in the second and ‘Songs from remakes’ in the third. In this article, I will be covering the first part, namely the ‘Inspired and adopted melodies’.”
As you have mentioned ‘Alibabavum 40 Thirudargalum (1956)’ was a remake. I have included two songs of this film in the post “Multiple Version Songs (15): In the ‘Realm of Remakes’ – Hindi to Tamil”, but not the song you have mentioned.
Here are the links to both the versions.
Masila Unmai Kathale by Bhanumathi and A M Rajah, film Alibabvum 40 Thirudargal (1956), lyrics A Maruthakasi, music S Dakshinamurthy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSUdeELcQGk
Ae Saba Unse Keh Zara by Asha Bhosle and Mohammed Rafi, film Alibaba And 40 Thieves (1954), lyrics Raja Mehdi Ali Khan, music S N Tripathi and Chitragupt. Sharda
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89HhxS8DHj8
Mr. Basha Mohamed,
@146
I have included one song from CID Shankar (1970) ‘Nanathale kangal minna minna’ (10T).
I am aware of another song from the film inspired by ‘Dil Se Dil Milakar Dekho’
But not the one mentioned by you.
But there many listeners in this group with sharp ears, may be one of them will come up with right answer.
You had mentioned in the beginning that no tunes have been copied from Tamil to Hindi movies in 50’s and 60’s. Generally true, but there were exceptions. One was of course meow, meow from Kumudam, later used in Pooja ke phool.
Another famous one was the song from Missiamma – Brindhavanamum Nandhakumaranum. In the Hindi version Miss Mary, it was Vrindavan ka krishna kanhaiya. I think Hemant Kumar was asked to use the same tune.
NT Nathan,
Welcome to SOY.
Mr.Nathan,
Thank you for visiting my post.
More than ten years has gone by since I wrote this piece.
I wrote,
“But during this period (upto 1960s), it is difficult to find any Tamil film melodies adopted in Hindi film music. I would be more than pleased, if our knowledgeable readers come up with examples to the contrary”
I also wrote,
“One would not find instance of any South Indian music director composing scores for Hindi films in the 50s, 60s or even in the 70s. Some of the double version or multi version films and dubbed films were the exceptions. In most of the Hindi remakes of the Tamil film, the Tamil music directors were replaced by North Indian music composers. The composers of the remakes preferred to score fresh tunes rather than retaining the original Tamil tunes. There were rare instances where they had retained the original tunes.”
Both the songs that you have cited are from “remakes”, the fact which you have mentioned. Both the songs have come up for discussion in the comments section, and I have replied that I would do a post on songs from Tamil to Hindi remakes, which did not materialize.
Venkataramanji,
You can still do it.
AKji,
May be after couple of months. Till then I am stuck in the south.
Venkataramanji,
Anytime as per your convenience.
great job i was seriously looking for angey yen intha parvai tamil song movie iru vallavargal from hindi movie april fool song mei reeta very pleasing to find and listen melody songs of hindi and tamil of that era really enjoying to know and hear music
Venkateswara Raghavan,
Welcome to SOY.
I came across some one sang a song in Hindi, Tamil. Telugu and Bengali which had the same tune
Any idea which it is?
Unfortunately I did not save that song
Ragu,
Interesting. Someone should be able to answer.